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nickrose's picture
Eventide Staff
nickrose
Joined: Jan 17 2008
Posts: 4184

MIDI Sysex Doc posted to eventide.com

(Eventide Staff)
January 15, 2018 - 11:16 am

The eagerly awaited stompbox MIDI Sysex document has been posted to the Eventide Web Site.

Note that this is an early version of this document and is subject to change without notice. It is intended for expert users, as little support can be offered.

Midi Sysex Messages

Tomtama
Joined: Dec 4 2017
Posts: 25

Excellent!! Thank you!

January 15, 2018 - 09:34 pm

Excellent!! Thank you!

jarvss
Joined: Sep 17 2016
Posts: 8

Preset v Program

March 06, 2018 - 07:42 pm

Hi,

I’ve built a Midi controller using a micro controller (Arduino). I have managed to get this to request and read a sysex dump for each preset on my H9. So now I have stored info on preset 0 to 99. But the only method I can see to specifically select a sound on the H9 is by sending a Program change. Program 1 might not be for Preset 1. This kind of makes the sysex data useless apart having info about the currently selected Preset/program.

I know I can do a next/previous preset via the cc messages but this seems strange seeing as I can’t select a preset only a Program.

Is there a cc or sysex message I can send to select a specific preset?

Thanks

PJ

nickrose's picture
Eventide Staff
nickrose
Joined: Jan 17 2008
Posts: 4184

jarvss wrote:

March 12, 2018 - 11:11 am

jarvss wrote:

Hi, I’ve built a Midi controller using a micro controller (Arduino). I have managed to get this to request and read a sysex dump for each preset on my H9. So now I have stored info on preset 0 to 99. But the only method I can see to specifically select a sound on the H9 is by sending a Program change. Program 1 might not be for Preset 1. This kind of makes the sysex data useless apart having info about the currently selected Preset/program. I know I can do a next/previous preset via the cc messages but this seems strange seeing as I can’t select a preset only a Program. Is there a cc or sysex message I can send to select a specific preset? Thanks PJ

Not sure what distinction you are drawing between Presets and Programs. Maybe by Program you mean Algorithm ?

The way to load a preset from MIDI is by using a Program Change message. I suppose you could use MIDI sysex to download a preset and then use another sysex to send it back, but this seem a bit of a fiddle.

 

jarvss
Joined: Sep 17 2016
Posts: 8

Program Change Map v specific Preset

March 12, 2018 - 11:34 am

nickrose wrote:

jarvss wrote:

Hi, I’ve built a Midi controller using a micro controller (Arduino). I have managed to get this to request and read a sysex dump for each preset on my H9. So now I have stored info on preset 0 to 99. But the only method I can see to specifically select a sound on the H9 is by sending a Program change. Program 1 might not be for Preset 1. This kind of makes the sysex data useless apart having info about the currently selected Preset/program. I know I can do a next/previous preset via the cc messages but this seems strange seeing as I can’t select a preset only a Program. Is there a cc or sysex message I can send to select a specific preset? Thanks PJ

Not sure what distinction you are drawing between Presets and Programs. Maybe by Program you mean Algorithm ?

The way to load a preset from MIDI is by using a Program Change message. I suppose you could use MIDI sysex to download a preset and then use another sysex to send it back, but this seem a bit of a fiddle.

 

Thanks for replying.

What I mean is a Program Change via the Map rather than a specified Preset.

If for example I send Program Change 4 to the H9 this might actually be mapped to Preset 2 in the H9 Map. If I change to Preset 2 on the H9 itself, the H9 sends Program Change 2 to my MIDI device. 

If I set the H9 to Merge then connect my MIDI device to the In and Out on the H9. I then send Program Change 4 from the MIDI device (as above) to the H9. The H9 then sends 2 messages:

- Program Change 4 for the Thru message 

- Program Change 2 for it's own Transmission

The Map is very powerful to work with things like my Standard MIDI pedal switcher, but I would like to be able to send a MIDI message that is telling the H9 that this is a specific Preset change and not a Program Change. I thought that there might be a Sysex message that would do this.

 

 

nickrose's picture
Eventide Staff
nickrose
Joined: Jan 17 2008
Posts: 4184

Still don't see the

March 14, 2018 - 02:46 pm

Still don't see the distinction.

Maybe by Program Change you mean MIDI Program Change via the MIDImap, and you are looking for something to bypass the MIDImap ?

If so, alas not. You would probably set the MIDImap to 1:1, so they are the same thing.

But, I am probably misunderstanding. Either way, the MIDI Program Change via the MIDImap is the only way to load things - no sysex.

 

 

leehu
Joined: Nov 11 2017
Posts: 7

Hi, thx for the doc. Just

March 14, 2018 - 04:14 pm

Hi, thx for the doc. Just doing a bit of playing around and recorded some sysex being sent from the H9 control app to the H9:

 

12:20:43.126   To H9 Pedal    SysEx              Eventide 38 bytes       F0 1C 70 00 60 1C 00 28 43 53 3A 4D 1E 6D 48 50 08 5C 6F 4C 19 33 66 44 01 00 46 4B 18 35 68 4C…

12:20:43.139   From H9 Pedal           SysEx              Eventide 14 bytes       F0 1C 70 01 60 07 00 2C 43 03 20 40 55 F7

12:20:43.156   To H9 Pedal    SysEx              Eventide 38 bytes       F0 1C 70 00 60 1C 00 28 4B 63 3A 4D 1E 6D 48 50 08 0C 4F 0D 1B 36 6C 5C 01 00 46 4B 19 30 72 50…

12:20:43.171   From H9 Pedal           SysEx              Eventide 14 bytes       F0 1C 70 01 60 07 00 2C 4B 03 20 00 56 F7

 

I'v'e tried to find the message in the doc but can't see anything relating to the 60 message code.

Any hints?

 

thx

 

leehu
Joined: Nov 11 2017
Posts: 7

Ni Nick, any input on this? I

March 16, 2018 - 12:05 pm

Ni Nick, any input on this? I'd like to be able to update parameters on the H9 at full resolution rather than using MIDI 0-127.

Also, when doing a patch dump from my H9 the header looks like this:

[1] 0 5 1

 

According to the docs, this is patch format 5 (rather than the 2 listed as an example) and has an extra digit on the end of it.

 

thx

 

 

jarvss
Joined: Sep 17 2016
Posts: 8

leehu wrote:

March 16, 2018 - 02:09 pm

leehu wrote:

Ni Nick, any input on this? I'd like to be able to update parameters on the H9 at full resolution rather than using MIDI 0-127.

Also, when doing a patch dump from my H9 the header looks like this:

[1] 0 5 1

 

According to the docs, this is patch format 5 (rather than the 2 listed as an example) and has an extra digit on the end of it.

 

thx

 

 

 

Not sure if this is any help but this doc was posted a few years ago:

http://ftp.eventide.com/ljdl/www/PresetFormatDescription.pdf 

It certainly matches the data returned from a MIDI Sysex request.

This is the original thread:

https://www.eventideaudio.com/node/6316#43016

 

leehu
Joined: Nov 11 2017
Posts: 7

jarvss wrote:

March 16, 2018 - 02:33 pm

jarvss wrote:

http://ftp.eventide.com/ljdl/www/PresetFormatDescription.pdf 

It certainly matches the data returned from a MIDI Sysex request.

Thanks for that - certainly seems to be more like what I'm received - maybe they included an old version in the document? That might also explain why the sysex messages I'm seeing coming from the H9 control app aren't documented.

 

Cheers

leehu
Joined: Nov 11 2017
Posts: 7

Hi, just tried processing a

March 20, 2018 - 07:31 am

Hi, just tried processing a full preset dump and getting responses of the form:

F0 1C 70 01 60

which again contains this undodcumented 60 message. Can someone from Eventide confirm that this posted doc is the correct doc as it really doesn't appear to be. thx

 

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nickrose
Joined: Jan 17 2008
Posts: 4184

leehu wrote:

March 20, 2018 - 10:42 am

leehu wrote:

Hi, just tried processing a full preset dump and getting responses of the form:

F0 1C 70 01 60

which again contains this undodcumented 60 message. Can someone from Eventide confirm that this posted doc is the correct doc as it really doesn't appear to be. thx

This document was produced by human beings so may have omissions and errors. It is however generally correct.

Message 60 is a special H9Control message. These are not documented as they are very complex and of little use to the user. They are also largely encrypted and thus  unreadable. They should be ignored. The same applies to messages 63-68.

 

 

leehu
Joined: Nov 11 2017
Posts: 7

Hi, thx for the replay Nick -

March 20, 2018 - 11:00 am

Hi, thx for the replay Nick - understand there are errors but just trying to clarify a few things and hopefully help you correct some of those errors.

1) Could you confirm that the only way we can update the unit is via MIDI CC and therefor parameters such as filter that have a 200 range (-100 to 100) can only be updated to a resolution of 0-128 by us?

2) In this section of the document:

SYSEXC_TJ_PRESETS_WANT 0x48 Data: None.

Response: The unit sends a SYSEXC_TJ_PRESETS_DUMP message 

SYSEXC_TJ_PRESETS_DUMP 0x49 Data: A dump of the all the presets in the unit. See Appendices for more information. Response: n/a

In response to the SYSEXC_TJ_PRESETS_WANT the unit actually sends a series of the 0x60 messages with no preset data, rather than a SYSEXC_TJ_PRESETS_DUMP. Is this correct behaviour? thx

nickrose's picture
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nickrose
Joined: Jan 17 2008
Posts: 4184

1) I assume that by "update"

March 20, 2018 - 01:37 pm

1) I assume that by "update" you mean remote control. You are correct that the way to remote control a parameter is by MIDI CC. But, you are incorrect about the ranging. The MIDI values 0-127 control the parameter over its entire range, so MIDI 0 is the minimum and MIDI 127 is the maximum.

2)  I'm guessing that you have H9control connected while you are sending your MIDI sysex requests. Sorry - you can't use MIDI and H9Control at the same time.

 

 

 

leehu
Joined: Nov 11 2017
Posts: 7

Thanks.

March 21, 2018 - 07:23 am

Thanks.

1) ok, understand that. but obviously with a resolution of 200 (-100 to 100), this cannot be controlled accurately via MIDI 0-127 so we lose resolution.

2) No, it's not connected - just the H9 over USB and me sending the dump message from Max/MSP.

cheers

leehu
Joined: Nov 11 2017
Posts: 7

2) ah, ok - I have had the

March 21, 2018 - 07:41 am

2) ah, ok - I have had the app connected but it had been shut down - I've now disconnected the H9 and reconnected it and it's dumping patterns as expected - thanks!

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nickrose
Joined: Jan 17 2008
Posts: 4184

leehu wrote:

March 21, 2018 - 06:23 pm

leehu wrote:

Thanks.

1) ok, understand that. but obviously with a resolution of 200 (-100 to 100), this cannot be controlled accurately via MIDI 0-127 so we lose resolution.

The first 32 MIDI channels can be operated as MIDI Double, which gives you 14 bits, but that's rather down to your controller. The H9 supports MIDI double.

To quote WikiP "This fine adjustment is part of the conventional MIDI controller specification, where any of the first 32 controls can be optionally paired with a control offset 32 higher. This is the rare 14-bit Continuous Controller feature of the MIDI specification"

Toodle pip !