Choppy: moog ep-3 -> H9 -> xmit cc #14 (xmit ch. #4) -> boss es-8 (rcv ch#4) -> assign cc#14 : exp 2 out -> moog mf drive

[rorytheherb]

moog ep-3 -> H9 -> xmit cc #14 (xmit ch. #4) -> boss es-8 (rcv ch#4) -> assign cc#14 : exp 2 out -> moog mf drive

I hope my subject title for the thread is not too terse, but I am hoping someone with experience doing a similar setup may be able to help solve my issue.

I already have two expression pedals plugged into the boss es-8, but i wanted to see if i could use all three by having my H9 receive expression and convert it to MIDI CC and send the MIDI CC to the ES-8, at which point I could convert the MIDI CC back to expression using an Assign. 

I have set this up. It works as expected, except for the fact that when I send the expression/CV out to my mf-drive (used as a wah basically) the filter cutoff frequency (i.e. the controlled parameter) jumps a lot, especially at the beginning when I first engage the pedal with my foot. 

I haven’t deduced whether this is due to the H9 or the Boss ES-8. I just got the ES-8 three days ago so I am still learning. One thing about the ES-8 that I realized is that you need to turn the ‘Func’ to ‘Off’ of the Exp1 and Exp2 outputs if you plan on setting up Assigns to send expression out, otherwise it will send two signals and cause glitching. Now, with the above setup, I am experience glitching that sounds similar but for a different unknown reason.

I am aware that setting up the H9 to receive MIDI CC and use it to control its own expression can overload it with too much MIDI data, resulting in glitching or slow-to-update values. My question is whether a similar thing is known to happen the other way around, i.e. is the H9 able to convert analog expression to MIDI CC and transmit it to an external device in a smooth fashion? 

 

thanks

Rory

 

 

 

[rorytheherb]

I will check to see whether the glitching has anything to do with being connected to H9 Control either by Bluetooth or USB MIDI, as it seems to be the case here:

https://www.eventideaudio.com/community/forum/stompboxes/pitchflex-alg-glitchy

 

[bohan]

rorytheherb wrote:

I have set this up. It works as expected, except for the fact that when I send the expression/CV out to my mf-drive (used as a wah basically) the filter cutoff frequency (i.e. the controlled parameter) jumps a lot, especially at the beginning when I first engage the pedal with my foot. 

I am aware that setting up the H9 to receive MIDI CC and use it to control its own expression can overload it with too much MIDI data, resulting in glitching or slow-to-update values. My question is whether a similar thing is known to happen the other way around, i.e. is the H9 able to convert the analog expression to MIDI CC and transmit it to an external device in a smooth fashion? 

Does BOSS ES-8 or its editor have a MIDI monitor? If so you can check its incoming MIDI messages while pedaling your Moog ep-3. If the MIDI messages are continuous and have proper start and end values, then it should not be H9's problem.

[rorytheherb]

Yes there is a MIDI monitor in the ES8 editor. I will take a look when I get home. I’m not sure how I would evaluate how continuous the incoming signal is. I am tempted to say the jumpiness is also apparent in the H9 control app’s view of the ribbon that tracks the hot knob/expression. 

[rorytheherb]

I couldn’t find the monitor in the ES-8 Editor but I looked in Midi Ox. A heel to toe sweep (0 – 127) is 00 to 7F in hex, and a toe-to-heel sweep is 7F to 00. Either way, the H9 is sending on average 36 messages.  

[bohan]

rorytheherb wrote:

I couldn't find the monitor in the ES-8 Editor but I looked in Midi Ox. A heel to toe sweep (0 – 127) is 00 to 7F in hex, and a toe-to-heel sweep is 7F to 00. Either way, the H9 is sending on average 36 messages.  

Have you tried calibrating your expression pedal on H9? You can do this in H9 Control: "Pedal Settings" -> "General Settings" -> "Pedal Calibration Disabled" -> switch it to "YES" and to "NO" again, and then move your expression pedal from heel to toe. H9 will learn your expression pedal and calibrate it. Let me know if this works.

[rorytheherb]

I tried sending the CC changes to the Boss with MIDI Ox and it seemed to be glitchy too. In addition, there seems to be a history of this issue with the Boss:

https://www.thegearpage.net/board/index.php?search/37838388/&q=exp&t=post&o=date&c%5Buser%5D%5B0%5D=40261&c%5Bthread%5D=1584166

 

I did already calibrate the H9 expression over and over. I think it is calibrated. I am going to try to get a hold of Roland/Boss though I am not optimistic they will provide a solution.

[nickrose]

MIDI is really not suitable as a high resolution modulation medium (on almost any equipment – some will be better than others).

It is essentially a low speed digital process, with a theoretical maximum update rate of about 1kHz.

In practise, since almost all MIDI equipment is doing other things as well, it will be MUCH slower, and some glitching will be apparent on fast changes.

You really can't consider it as a remote control voltage – a directly connected pedal (for example) will be much more responsive than a MIDI pedal.

MIDI was really designed for loading presets and setting parameters, rather than for high speed modulation.

 

 

 

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