h9: AUX sw – program change question

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    • #162711
      luedmo
      Participant

      hello!

      I got multiple h9s and want to setup so:

      • with separate MIDI channels for each h9 (I tweak parameters from an Arturia MIDI kybd, works fine) and for program changes use a
      • a Digitech FS3X AUX footswitch (which is attached the h9 #1 EXP input) sends simple Progam-Changes to H9 # 2 and h9 #3 . This works fine only if:
        a) all H9s are set to same MIDI channel / Omni
        b) the h9#1’s XMT CH is set to the MIDI channel of H9#2 (and h9#1’s mdi OUTPUT is set to MERGE)

      Repeating the ‘XMT CH’ trick on hp#2 doesn’t seem to work for h9#3 – which does not receive the PC messages from the Digitech FS3X.

      I’ve tried it each way but I am beginning to suspect it might not be possible  to have multiple h9s set to different MIDI channels AND for the FS3X to make simple inc/dec patch changes?

      Is it so? Any other ideas much appreciated…
      🙂

      Thanks

      :L

    • #162712
      joecozzi
      Moderator
      Eventide Staff

      Hi luedmo,

      I commend you on using one of H9’s most powerful MIDI capabilities with having the aux switch generate a MIDI command. But the reason it doesn’t work from H9-2 to H9-3 is because there’s no command being generated. H9-2 only receives the command via MIDI from H9-1, but it doesn’t generate a new one to pass it on.

      The only solution would be to try splitting the signal from your FS3X to your H9-1 and H9-3. This way, your current programming will work for 1 & 2 but now you’ll also have 3 responding to its aux input as well. Or the second option, which I highly recommend, invest in a more advanced MIDI foot controller that has a MIDI input, so you can use the Keyboard to play with parameters, but have the MIDI switches to control your preset mapping. MIDI Baby 3 from Disater Area comes to mind or the MC6MKII from Morningstar would also be compact and work well giving you a few more options.

    • #162713
      joecozzi
      Moderator
      Eventide Staff
      • a Digitech FS3X AUX footswitch (which is attached the h9 #1 EXP input) sends simple Progam-Changes to H9 # 2 and h9 #3 . This works fine only if:a) all H9s are set to same MIDI channel / Omnib) the h9#1’s XMT CH is set to the MIDI channel of H9#2 (and h9#1’s mdi OUTPUT is set to MERGE)

      Quick question on your method here, when you say the FS3X sends “simple Program Changes to 2 & 3, what do you have the FS3X mapped to, the increment and decrement functions?

    • #162716
      luedmo
      Participant

      Thanks Joe
      Maybe I am not being clear but…
      …yes, FS3X is mapped via the SYSTEM/AUX SW options so that NXT and LST (inc/dec) are  ‘T+R’ and ‘RING’
      I am not sure if a FS3X set up like that generates an actual MIDI Progam Change, but it does shift the patches (presets, whatever they’re called) +1 or -1

      It would be so cool if this worked, because then the external MIDI controllers would work nicely, and there wold be a robust failsafe inc/dec

      fwiw: I have the

      • Arturia 49 essentials (which is easy to set up so different knobs generate different CCs on different MIDI Channels)
      • KMI Softstep (which “could” do the inc/dec but I wanted to keep for other purposes

      also, as you see, I do not 100% trust MIDI…

      Thanks

      :L

    • #162718
      luedmo
      Participant

      Also
      Thanks for the MIDI controller suggestions,
      Morningstar MC3 looks compact and easy to program,
      However, if I have to use the KMI softstep that may be the cheapest way ahead 😉

      :L

    • #162719
      joecozzi
      Moderator
      Eventide Staff

      I got it working using your method. On H9-2, RCV CH has to be set to 2 (for H9-2)

      XMT CH has to be set to 3 (for H9-3)

      RCV.CTL has to be set to NXT.CC#A, LST.CC#B

      XMT CC for RING and T+R have to be set to the CC#s on H9-1.

      CTL.XMT set to ON,

      PGM.XMT has to be turned ON.

      OUTPUT has to be set to MERGE.

      H9-3 has to be set to:

      RCV CH: 3

      RV.CTL: NXT.CC#A & LST.CC#B

    • #162724
      luedmo
      Participant

      hi Joe

      Thanks for your help on this! We are so close, but…
      The h9-3 does change but it then jams up (solved by unplugging the MIDI cable or tap-tapping on the presets button).
      I’ve tried everything I can, even separated the TIP & RING on the FS3X footswitch, played about with XMT.MAP
      fwiw – one H9 reacts slightly better being h9-3 in the MIDI chain then the other

      Below are my settings, maybe you can see what I am doing wrong?
      I see that there is a LST and NXT in RCV.MAP – might that have any bearing on it all

      Best,
      :L

      h91
      AUX SW:
      – NXT : RING
      – LST : TIP
      RCV CH : 10
      XMT CH : 11
      RCV.CTL
      – NXT : OFF
      – LST : OFF
      Show More...

      XMT CC
      – TIP : cc# 97 (dec)
      – RNG : cc# 96 (inc)
      – T+R : off
      RCV.MAP – all PGs offset +1 apart from
      – 121 : LST (irrelevant?)
      – 122 : NXT (irrelevant?)
      XMT.MAP – all offset -1
      CTL.XMT : ON
      PGM.XMT : ON
      OUTPUT : MERGE

      h92
      AUX SW: DISABLED
      RCV CH : 11
      XMT CH : 12
      RCV.CTL
      – NXT : cc# 96
      – LST : cc# 97
      XMT CC
      – TIP : cc# 97 (dec)
      – RNG : cc# 96 (inc)
      – T+R : off
      CTL.XMT : ON
      PGM.XMT : ON
      OUTPUT : MERGE.

      H9-3
      AUX SW: DISABLED
      RCV CH: 12
      XMT CH : 12
      RCV.CTL
      – NXT : cc# 96
      – LST : cc# 97
      XMT CC
      – TIP : OFF
      – RNG : OFF
      – T+R : OFF
      CTL.XMT : ON
      PGM.XMT : ON
      OUTPUT : MERGE.

       

       

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    • #162725
      joecozzi
      Moderator
      Eventide Staff

      Don’t worry about RCV.MAP. We don’t need to touch that.

      The only other difference between my working setup and yours is that H9-3 is set to:

      CTL.XMT: OFF
      PGM.XMT: OFF
      OUTPUT: XMT

      It’s possible setting the output to MERGE might be upsetting the chain. I’m not sure. Try it.

    • #162733
      luedmo
      Participant

      Hi Joe
      It’s working!
      I’ll check through all the settings over the next few days, switching round the H9s to see if one of them is defective (in any way) etc. and let you know if I find anything out…

      🙂

      :l

    • #162736
      luedmo
      Participant

      Solved

      Digitech FS3X has this written above the buttons:

      • TIP – MODE
      • RING – DOWN
      • T&R – UP

      When I repeat that layout inside the H9, I got weird offsets, e.g. h9-1 ends up either 1 or 2 presets apart from H9-2 or h9-3.

      One solution seems to be: keep TIP and RING separate (i.e. do not use T+R for UP).

      • TIP – DOWN
      • RING – UP
      • T&R – (e.g. Hotswitch or BYPASS etc.)

      :L
      ps: Having OUTPUT set to MERGE has no bad effect

    • #162737
      luedmo
      Participant

      Digitech FS3X weirdness #2…

      The FS3X is plugged into the h9-1 EXP port
      All 3 buttons are working good (DOWN, UP and P-SW)

      I attach another FSX3 to the h9-2 EXP port, just to see if to would work and…

      • TIP – gets a 100-0 readout on the H9-2
      • RNG – no effect
      • T&R – gets a 100-17 readout

      Looking closely at H9-2 in H9 control, shows that both switches get the same Hotswitch action. The funny thing is that pressing either the TIP or T+R results in a 0-100 behaviour, but… after you press TIP (once) T+R goes to the 17-100 behaviour

      Same goes for h9-3, so this does not appear to be anomalous to one h9 pedal.

      Perhaps this is not a bug, but a feature?

      :L

      ps: this whole thing is about trying to use multiple h9s to ‘morph’ presets using simple mechanical pedals like the digitech FS3X, and it sort of works…

    • #162739
      joecozzi
      Moderator
      Eventide Staff

      You could be experiencing erratic behavior if the H9-2 & H9-3 aux switch settings under PEDAL > General Settings > Expression Jack is not set to “Aux Switch.” Also, if you have any mappings in PEDAL > Aux Switch Mappings that could be interfering.

    • #162784
      luedmo
      Participant

      Thanks Joe
      Currently everything is working good
      I’ll clean up all those parameters & let you know if there’s any more issues
      One extra feature of this set up is all h9 parameters change from the highest H9 tweak (i.e. H9-1 controls 2 & 3). Useful for MIX
      When any H9 connected to the H9 Control, it bypassed any internal MIDI transmissions so you can edit the single patch on a single H9
      :L

    • #162785
      joecozzi
      Moderator
      Eventide Staff

      Thanks for reporting back. I’m thrilled you got it working. Again, I commend you for making full use of this H9 MIDI capability. You taught me something in the process. Best of luck to you.

    • #162811
      luedmo
      Participant

      FS3X update:
      Setup is working, but here are some things
      a) I removed the T+R P-SW XMT CC setting from H9-1 (that way I get control over the H9-1 P-SW function)
      b) Using the XYZ buttons of course means all downstream H9s parameters are edited. Sort of OK, but it’d be better not
      c) I thought to re-solder the FS3X switch so UP and DOWN are on the sides with MODE in the middle, but it’s a ribbon strip… 🙁
      d) I am beginning to suspect that hooking in H9control to edit an H9 messes things up downstream (normally USB blocks MIDI XMTs)
      e) I thought if I could plug in a micro-USB cable into the H9 it would bypass MIDI, but it doesn’t
      :L

    • #162814
      luedmo
      Participant

      FS3X update 2

      This setup is also working, with separate PSW for each H9, with inc/dec for Presets

      h91 =================
      AUX SW:
      – NXT : RING
      – LST : TIP
      – PSW : T+R
      RCV CH : 10
      XMT CH : 11
      RCV.CTL
      – NXT : OFF
      – LST : OFF
      – PSW : OFF
      XMT CC
      – TIP : cc# 97 (dec)
      – RNG : cc# 96 (inc)
      – T+R : OFF
      RCV.MAP – [not relevant]
      Show More...

      XMT.MAP – [not relevant]
      CTL.XMT : ON
      PGM.XMT : ON
      OUTPUT : MERGE

      h92 =================
      AUX SW: AUX Switch
      – NXT : OFF
      – LST : OFF
      – PSW : T+R
      RCV CH : 11
      XMT CH : 12
      RCV.CTL
      – NXT : cc# 96
      – LST : cc# 97
      – PSW : OFF
      XMT CC
      – TIP : cc# 97 (dec)
      – RNG : cc# 96 (inc)
      – T+R : OFF
      CTL.XMT : ON
      PGM.XMT : ON
      OUTPUT : MERGE.

      H9-3
      AUX SW: AUX Switch
      – NXT : OFF
      – LST : OFF
      – PSW : T+R
      RCV CH: 12
      XMT CH : 12
      RCV.CTL
      – NXT : cc# 96
      – LST : cc# 97
      – PSW : OFF
      XMT CC
      – TIP : OFF
      – RNG : OFF
      – T+R : OFF
      CTL.XMT : ON
      PGM.XMT : ON
      OUTPUT : MERGE.

      I think

      :L

       

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