H90 help needed with dual mode

[stratnurd]

Hello everyone,

I’ve just bought an H90 and fitted it to my pedalboard. I thought it would be great to create two routing paths to get the most out of it.
I use various distortion and overdrive pedals, as well as chorus and delay effects. I have a Musicomlab EFX MKVI switcher, to which I’ve connected all these pedals in the available loops. The overdrives come first, and at the end of ‘the chain’ I use loop 12 of the switcher to amplify stereo effects. This loop 12  is actually a small group of effects connected in series and looped together to save loops. Now, to make good use of the H90, I’ve connected the switcher’s Loop 2 send and return to Input 1 and Output 1, which has become my first signal path for the H90, and the left and right outputs of my H9 which is the start of my stereo chain in loop 12  i connected to Inputs 3 and 4 of the H90 – which has become my second signal path. The H90’s OUTPUT 3 and 4 then feed back into the switcher’s L+R returns. I’ve now set the H90 to Dual mode, but I find that when I engage a distortion pedal that comes after loop 2, the sound comes across as thin and harsh. I’ve tried using PRE/POST and also other routing but i don;t get the result i want. I think it’s because my distortion is now also going through the H90, which colours the sound differently, but I don’t know how to fit it. The sound also seems a bit phasey. What am I doing wrong?

Help is very much appreciated.

Regards, Collin

 

[stratnurd]

I would also like to mention that:

I use 12V 1A power

As i play guitar all in & outputs are set to instrument level
<p style=”text-align: left;”>There is way more white noise when i engage a distortionpedal then before.</p>
Maybe it’s usefull to share and find a proper solution for the lack of quality in sound.

[tsternfeld]

Hi, Sorry to hear you’re having trouble.

It sounds like you may have an issue with the dry signal being mixed back improperly, but it’s difficult to tell what the source of the issue is from the description.  If you can draw a diagram, that would be helpful.  It also may be helpful to simplify your setup to the minimum configuration that causes the problem.  I would try each of the following, and see if the issue persists:

– Bypass the H90 (using DSP bypass)

– Remove the H9

– Replace the H90 in Loop 2 of the switcher with a cable

If you can find what change helps the issue, that may guide you towards a solution.  You may also want to review the placement of buffers in your setup.  Some distortion pedals do not play nicely when fed by a buffered signal, and the H90 acts as a buffer when running effects or in DSP bypass.

[stratnurd]

Hi, ok i will explain my routing in more detail:

The first 11 loops are all mono and connected by send & return from the switcher to the in and output off the pedal.

The overdrive pedal in loop 9 is re-orderd in the switcher after the h90 in loop2 which you can do in the musicomlab switcher without to physically cable them

Routing:

Shure wireless > Wah pedal >Guitar input switcher > Loop 1 cali76 comp. / loop 2 send & ret to H90 input 1 and output 1 / loop3 lightspeed od / loop 4 tumnus od / Loop 5 boost pedal / Loop 6 volume / loop 9 Friedman OD /

Loop 10 EQ2 / Loop 11 Friedman IR-D, i don’t use the mono fx loop of the IR-D by the way…

Then the stereo part start here: as you can see i connected those last pedals in the chain in series to save loops, otherwise i would have to join 2 mono loops to become 1 loop in stereo

Loop 12 send > H9 input

H9 output L & R > H90 input 3 & 4

H90 output 3 & 4 > Big Sky inputs

Big Sky outputs > Nux Looper pedal inputs

Nux looper outputs > loop 12 Return L + Loop 12 Return  R

Then finaly :

Switcher LEFT OUT > Radial LEFT INPUT > Radial Thru > Monitor 1
Switcher ISO OUT > Radial RIGHT INPUT > Radial Thru > Monitor 2

This is basically the whole routing and i would really like to use the H90 with all it’s flexibility regarding to routings.

So distortions and pitchshifters in another signalpath then the chorusses and delays.

I want to do this in  INSERT MODE of the H90 and use it full potential.

But unfortunately my sound is not great at this moment and there must be a better way to connect it all together, it’s way to noisy with use of distortion and the effects can sound much more clear i believe.

What am i doing wrong? Probably something with the friedman in loop 11 and the connections in the H90 but i am having a hard time solving this properly.

What should I do to get better results ?

Help is appreciated, thanks in advance.

 

Best regards, Collin

 

 

[stratnurd]

Hi, ok i will explain my routing in more detail, i already tried many things and removed the H9 out of the H90, i also altered the cablingmethod and this is what i have right now.

I thinks it’s way better than it was but i just want to make sure i’m not doing anything wrong here.

Part 1: Input & Mono Drives (Loops 1 -10)

Gitaar ➡️ Shure Wireless ➡️ Wah Pedal ➡️ Musicom Lab efx mkVI GUITAR IN.Loop 1: Cali76 Compressor
Loop 2: Free space
Loop 3: Greer Amps Lightspeed
Loop 4: Wampler Tumnus
Loop 5: Boost Pedaal
Loop 6: Volumepedaal
Loop 9: Friedman OD
Loop 10: Source Audio EQ2

Part 2: Loop 11 (Amp & H90 section)

EFX-MKVI Send 11 ➡️ Eventide H90 Input 1
Eventide H90 Output 1 ➡️ Friedman IR-D Guitar Input
Friedman IR-D Main Out ➡️ Eventide H90 Input 3
Eventide H90 Output 3 ➡️ EFX-MKVI Return 11

Part 3: Stereo chain (Loop 12)

EFX-MKVI Send 12 (Mono) ➡️ Eventide H9 Input 1 (Mono)
Eventide H9 Output 1 & 2 (Stereo L/R) ➡️ Strymon BigSky Inputs L/R
Strymon BigSky Outputs L/R ➡️ Nux Looper Inputs L/R
Nux Looper Outputs L/R ➡️ EFX-MKVI Return 12 L & R (Stereo)

Part 4: Outputs to Monitors

EFX-MKVI LEFT OUT ➡️ Radial LEFT INPUT ➡️ Radial Thru ➡️ Monitor A
EFX-MKVI RIGHT OUT ➡️ Radial RIGHT INPUT ➡️ Radial Thru ➡️Monitor  C

What do you think?

I believe it’s much better this way but i’m kinda struggling with all the possibilities in routing choices for all these sounds in the H90 and all the options for those sounds.

What is the best routing method for me when i use high gain from my pedal with a taste of chorus out of the H90 for example?

 

Best regards, Collin

[tsternfeld]

The latter route does seem cleaner, but as you note it doesn’t use the H90’s IO to the full potential.

If you want to set up the H90 on two location in the switcher, I think you’ll find that using Dual mode is actually more flexible and has less room for error. Using Insert mode will require you to manage latency compensation and dry/wet/bypass routing across multiple loops on the switcher, which will be painful.  Dual mode lets you treat the H90 as two separate pedals.

The best advice I can give is to take your first setup and systematically remove or bypass components until the sound improves. That will let you track down the specific interaction/route that is causing the problem.

“Best” routing method in a complex setup like this is going to be strongly dependent on your specific taste and needs.

[rantanplan747]

Impressive board! Have you tried switching the ins and outs of the H90 to instrument / line level? So that the H90 doesn’t introduce unwanted level changes.

Also, I can relate to this:

i’m kinda struggling with all the possibilities in routing choices for all these sounds in the H90 and all the options for those sounds.

When I first got my H90, I struggled with the exact same thing. So many sounds, so many routing possibilities, but “only” two algorithms at once… I spent more time planning in my head what could be done than using it and actually creating sounds. So my advice would be to focus more on what you wanna do rather than thinking about what could be done in theory. Or, just solve the problem by throwing money at it and get the H9000 😉

Good luck!

[stratnurd]

Hi,

Ok i will go back to my initial setup in DUAL MODE with some slight changes, i ditched the Lehle isolator because the Radial also does the same job.

i will put the H90 first mono signalpath in loop 2 of the switcher by connecting the send and the return of the switcher and connect it to H90 Input 1 and output 1.

The second stereo part will be my stereo signal in loop 12. This loop consist of an H9, the H90 itself, The Big Sky reverb and a Nux stereo looper pedal which i will connect as below.

SEND LOOP 12 SWITCHER > H9 input

H9 OUT L > H90 INPUT 3

H9 OUT R > H90 INPUT 4

H90 OUTPUT 3 > BIG SKY L INPUT

H90 OUTPUT 4 > BIG SKY R INPUT

BIG SKY L OUT > NUX L INPUT

BIG SKY R OUT > NUX R INPUT

NUX L OUT > Switcher return L

NUX R OUT > Switcher return R

So now the H90 is connected in TWO loops of the switcher, LOOP 2 mono and LOOP 12 in stereo.

Loop 2 is early in the looporder of the switcher and the stereo loop 12 is the last one in the looporder.

So when everything works out fine this will probably be the most flexible routing for me right? Regardless of musical taste.

I will do so after a confirmation from your side as this is much work and i want to make sure this works 100% before i tear my pedalboard upside down again 🙂

Thanks in advance.

Best regards, Collin

 

[stratnurd]

Hi,

Thanks for your reply.

Yes i did experiment with output levels but it did no do what i expected it to do.

So it was overwhelming for you too in the beginning?

I believe we are not the only ones, it can be a pain sometimes figuring this stuff out.

Thanks for the tip to go from”what i want to do with it ”

Best regards, Collin

 

[tsternfeld]

stratnurd wrote:

So now the H90 is connected in TWO loops of the switcher, LOOP 2 mono and LOOP 12 in stereo. Loop 2 is early in the looporder of the switcher and the stereo loop 12 is the last one in the looporder. So when everything works out fine this will probably be the most flexible routing for me right? Regardless of musical taste.

I’ve seen too many different musical tastes represented in setups to disregard it.  What you’re suggesting sounds sensible, and will be very flexible, but with a setup this complex everything will depend on *your* taste and *your* goals with the setup.

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