Pitchfactor Diatonic Key Switching

[stringrazor]

I've just acquired a 2nd hand PF (still in transit) and I'm psyched! I bought it based on the Eventide reputation and haven't played with one yet. I'm hoping I'll easily be able to do what I need, which is to switch keys on the fly while playing. 

For example, in the Eagles "Hotel California", during the verses there are multi-tracked guitar harmony lines. I currently use a Johnson/Digitech JM150 amp * J12 controller and that system allows me to switch intelligent harmony keys by stepping on a momentary switch. When the switch is released, the key returns to default. So, Bm is set as default when the switch off and when the switch is on it changes to BMaj.  (Note: this is *exactly* what's played on the record but it works and is very close).

I know the PF has  a feature that will determine a scale using an aux audio input but I'd rather not use that fearure…too much to go wrong live. From what I've read in the manual, it looks like I can set up two patches in the same bank and switch back and forth. Is the switching of the PF fast enough to do that while playing? 

It also seems that I can use an aux footswitch to change parms on the fly. If I do that, will the unit work like my current setup and revert back to the "default" parm when the momentary switch is released or will it take another press to go back?

One more Q: My unit is 2nd hand and I don't know if the previous owner registered it. Will I be able to get s/w updates if he has registered? It was an ebay purchase so I can prove ownership.

Thanks and I can't wait for it to arrive!

[nickrose]

stringrazor:

From what I've read in the manual, it looks like I can set up two patches in the same bank and switch back and forth. Is the switching of the PF fast enough to do that while playing? 

Preset switching on the PF is pretty fast, and this Forum is not full of complaints about it, but you'll have to judge for yourself.

stringrazor:

It also seems that I can use an aux footswitch to change parms on the fly. If I do that, will the unit work like my current setup and revert back to the "default" parm when the momentary switch is released or will it take another press to go back?

Parameter changes cannot be "undone", so you'll have to reload the preset or explicitly put the value back. Typically, you set one value for switch up and another for switch down.

stringrazor:

My unit is 2nd hand and I don't know if the previous owner registered it. Will I be able to get s/w updates if he has registered?

If he has registered it, contact support@eventide.com to get it changed.

[stringrazor]

nickrose:

Parameter changes cannot be "undone", so you'll have to reload the preset or explicitly put the value back. Typically, you set one value for switch up and another for switch down.

Thanks for your response. So, if I set Min/Max key values to trigger via aux switch, will it work like this:

1) selecting the patch, the key defaults to the MIN value

2) when the aux switch is pressed AND released, the key is set to MAX value

3) when the aux switch is pressed AND released again, the key returns to MIN value

or like this:

1) selecting the patch, the key defaults to the MIN value

2) when the aux switch is pressed,  the key is set to MAX value

3) when the aux switch is released, the key returns to MIN value

I suspect you're saying it's the former rather than the latter.  If that's the case, can the key be changed on the fly using an expression pedal? That's have I have it setup on the Digitech RP500 (too bad the intelligent pitch shift function is of such low quality on that unit. I can't use it at all in a live situation). Another suggestions that would keep tap-dancing to a minimum?

[nickrose]

None of the above, and probably not quite what you're looking for.

1) selecting the patch, the key defaults to the PATCH value

2) when the aux switch is pressed,  the key is set to MAX value

3) when the aux switch is released, the key is set to MIN value

Essentially, you will have to set the patch values to be the same as MIN value to do what you want.

[stringrazor]

nickrose:

None of the above, and probably not quite what you're looking for.

1) selecting the patch, the key defaults to the PATCH value

2) when the aux switch is pressed,  the key is set to MAX value

3) when the aux switch is released, the key is set to MIN value

Essentially, you will have to set the patch values to be the same as MIN value to do what you want.

OK, cool. That'll be perfect, thanks.

[stringrazor]

Just fyi, I tried patch 1/2 patch switching within a bank and it's too slow and cuts off harmony notes. I can almost make it work since the phrase isn't very fast but I have to be very precise with the switch (left …right….left…right, etc) and that's not gonna work live on stage. I hoping either an aux switch or an expression pedal will do the trick.

[stringrazor]

1) nope – when selecting a patch, if the aux switch is set it defaults to MAX value, not MIN as stated in the manual norPATCH as you stated,  at least that's what I'm seeing.

2) yup

3) nope – it latches so it needs to be pressed again (release has no effect) to go to MIN. Is there a latching option I missed reading about?

I'm also disappointed to learn that the aux switch settings are global and not per patch.

The tracking is good but not what I would have expected from an Eventide product. It still gets confused occasionally in diatonic mode with a single sustained note as input.

I can make it work, but I'll have to use the aux switch. There's no practical way I can see to cleanly switch scales while playing without an expression pedal or aux switch. This is more of a concern when I have to fly to a gig as it's so hard to carry much these days.

[caveman]

I've been changing shift intervals mid song by setting one of my aux switches to PDL mode, then using PDL programming to set the changes however I want for both up and down modes.  Gives better flexibility than assiging a switch to a knob.  Maybe this could help you change keys during your song…

[stringrazor]

Don't completely understand what you mean. I saw that the AUX SW settings include PDL but I'm not clear what that does. Would you explain in a bit more detail how you're using it? Thanks.

[caveman]

When you set an aux switch to PDL, it behaves like an expression pedal, but with the limitation that the only values are 0 and 100%, with nothing in between.  You can set 0% to be one key, then 100% to be the other key using the normal expression pedal programming procedure.

[stringrazor]

Thanks, I wondered what that did.

Someone over at thegearpage.net said he uses a momentary switch plugged into the expression pedal port. I tried that today and it works like a charm!

I suppose it very similar to what you suggest. The advantage of using the pedal input is that it takes a simple T-R (mono) plug and I can use a simple, small, light plastic keyboard sustain pedal instead of the large metal 3-button momentary switch I have (the "J3" that came with my Johnson/Digitech Amp), less size and weight for fly-away gigs and less pedalboard real estate. I'll probably also set up your suggested method and use the J3 for home gigs.

Now, if only the on-board FLEX/LEARN switch could be made to function like the AUX PDL. I wouldn't need anything external.

[kdills]

I am looking to do exactly what Stringrazor describes but I am not as savvy as he is…. I literally bought an H9 today because my band is losing a guitarist and we’re going as a 4 piece. That means I want to generate harmonies on Hotel California and also on Reeling in the Years. 

Both songs require the pitchshifter to change pitch on certain notes. I am at a loss for how to make that happen and the manual doesn’t do a good job of helping me understand how to do it.

Any thoughts from the crowd?

[stringrazor]

kdills wrote:

I am looking to do exactly what Stringrazor describes but I am not as savvy as he is…. I literally bought an H9 today because my band is losing a guitarist and we’re going as a 4 piece. That means I want to generate harmonies on Hotel California and also on Reeling in the Years. 

Both songs require the pitchshifter to change pitch on certain notes. I am at a loss for how to make that happen and the manual doesn’t do a good job of helping me understand how to do it.

Any thoughts from the crowd?

I don’t have an H9 so I can only offer general guidelines. Since neither the H9 nor PF have user-definable harmony capability, your first challenge is to find a scale and key setting that works for MOST of the run you want to harmonize. If like me, you’re not a theory expert, the only recourse is trial and error. It may be best to record your run and play it back into the H9 while you search for a good setting. Most likely, some notes will be harmonized “wrong” for the run. for those notes, you have to find alternate settings. Finding settings that work for all of the notes in the run is half the battle. 

Next you need to see if the H9 can quickly switch between the setting you have chosen using an external controller, either a MIDI message or a pedal switch like I was using on the PF. Once you know what you want to switch between, I’m sure folks here can tell you how to do it on an H9.  Good luck!

FYI, I’ve moved on from the PF, though I still have it. I’m now using a Fractal Axe/FX II which has the capability to hold 32 user definable harmonies which can be switched instantly via MIDI or a pedal switch. It”s absolutely the best guitar device I’ve ever used! 

[camn]

I dont know if it helps.. but I use this preset for the arpeggios in “Uprising” by Muse. You could use it for any 4 notes, really.. but I use it for an arpeggio that is MINOR with my exp peda at Heel.. and MAJOR at toe. Its from PitchFuzz.. not PF, so you need an H9 for it. BUT- it follows whatever key I play the root of. MINOR at heel, Major at toe. If you were really clever you could hot switch to a DIM/AUG… but that sounds hard

I play it live with no issues. 

I do have to have pretty precise timing.. and flip the EXP about an 8th note early.. but it is no problem if I haven’t been drinking too much 🙂 

In case you cant see it… Pitch B is assigned to the EXP. 

Of course you could use the hotswitch for this as well.. My EXP is just more accessible. 

[kdills]

I appreciate the feedback and I think I know what I need to do, although the ‘how’ is my greatest challenge.

I want to use a momentary switch instead of an expression pedal, I think… but I still can’t really find anything in the user manual about how to set a value for the pitch when the switch is engaged.

Does anyone know how to do that on a H9?

[camn]

There are two ways.
You can use an Aux Switch defined as “Performance Switch” with algos that support it, or attach a momentary switch to you Expression Pedal leads for ‘instant expression’ for algos that don’t.

I’d use the first, and I’d use PitchFuzz
On my patch above you just have to assign the alternative voicing to the ‘Hotswitch’ instead of the expression pedal.

[brock]

Check out the links below.  A bit of a ‘changing harmony’ mashup of MIDI control, aux switch to expression pedal mapping, direct parameter control via switch, and some HotSwitch references:

https://www.eventideaudio.com/comment/31094#comment-31094

https://www.eventideaudio.com/comment/27713#comment-27713

https://www.eventideaudio.com/comment/28364#comment-28364

https://www.eventideaudio.com/comment/7167#comment-7167

https://www.eventideaudio.com/comment/21929#comment-21929

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