Problem with TF and gain channel

[mavrick12x]

Hello all here's the issue,

I currently run the TF in front of my Orange MKII Rockerverb 50w combo instead of the effects loop because I also run the TF in stereo into my VOX AC15C1. What is happening is a hiss coming out of my Orange Amp when the gain channel is engaged. the hiss is not present in the vox or the clean stage of the Orange.

I ran the Orange with no inputs plugged in and the dirty stage was silent. I then put Output 1 on the TF to the input of the Orange with no input on the TF and the hiss was there.

I have the TF set to Guitar and Amp line settings. I also tried on line levels for both and the hiss was still there..

Am I missing something?

thanks in advance

[timothyhill]

There's been a ton of posts here about similar issues, so you might want to search around for those to see if they help.

Without restating a lot of things, there are several problems you could have… bad cable, bad jack on the amp, bad tube(s) in the amp, ground loop between TF and Orange, etc., etc. Try a new cable or try an isolation box between the TF and Orange. Just apply some basic trouble-shooting and you should be able to figure out what's causing the noise and how to fix it.

[mavrick12x]

so i dig some digging on the forum and it seems like hiss is a problem others have had. that being said i have done some troubleshooting in the mean time. I had thought that my vox didnt have this issue but i was wrong. the hiss is there but only noticeable at high volumes.

my tests were done with just the timefactor my vox ac15c1 and my guitars…

amp on by itself no inputs = no hiss.. dead silence

amp with guitar 1(usa fender tele highway one stock) = no hiss

amp with guitar 2(Epiphone LP w/ gibson standard pu's) = no hiss

Eventide(Set at guitar & amp) > amp = hiss

Eventide(Set at LINE LVLS) > amp = hiss

Guitar 1>Eventide(Set at guitar & amp)>amp = hiss

guitar 2>Eventide(Set at guitar & amp)>amp = hiss

Guitar 1>Eventide(Set at LINE LVLS)>amp = hiss

guitar 2>EventideEventide(Set at LINE LVLS)>amp = hiss

everytime i used the eventide i got hiss… lower volumes not a big deal with my vox but this amp also doesnt have a dedicated efx loop either… im not expecting much difference when i try my timefactor with my orange next time…

i did notice that some people talked about some kind of buffer. could someone name a product that would work and maybe explain this a little.

[timothyhill]

I think the most likely culprit is a ground loop between the Vox and the TF.

You could try changing the orientation of the TF wall-wart (I mean literally turning it over and plugging it into the wall/extension cord/power-strip upside-down). Not sure if this will help… sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't, but it's quick, free, and easy, so worth a shot.

There are several isolation boxes on the market… one is the EbTech EB-2, which works well in most applications. Those are around $65 give or take, but there are other alternatives and if it doesn't work, you can return it. The idea is to use a transformer to pass the signal from one device to another without any direct electrical connection (just to avoid any confusion with some "hum eliminators" that are really variations on noise gates or pass filters or other types of EQs – won't fix the problem, just covers it up and your tone right along with it).

The Factors do boost the treble response a bit when not using true bypass, so this may be what you're hearing (if it's more a high-frequency hiss and not a lower-frequency hum). What bypass type are you using? You could try true bypass to see if it helps (I'd miss the tails naturally decaying, but that's just me and certainly not for every song or every player).

Have you tried different cables? Maybe longer cables so you can move the TF father away from the VOX or any power supplies and/or power strips, or maybe rotate the pedal in relation to the VOX (offset by 90 degrees seems to be the best). Maybe different tubes? The tube closest to the input is usually the culprit and might be causing an impedence mis-match, but again, I'm not looking at the VOX schemactic at the moment, so I can't tell you exactly what's going on there.

Also, I don't know the specs of the AC15C1 off the top of my head, but there may be an input impendence mis-match, although that's only a slight possibility. If you have another pedal that you know doesn't produce the hiss, you could try putting it between the TF and the amp. Boss pedals are usually a good choice, although the buffers in the TF are really good, too, and I'd be a little surprised if that's where your hiss is coming from.

The only other thing I can think of is that Vox makes some notoriously "noisy" amplifiers, and always has, but hey, at least they don't burst into flame any more, right?? They're not all noisy and the ones that are seem to only be noisy when they want to be. (But, almost all of them sound really good!) And at least you know you're not the only one dealing with this issue, nor does it seem to be just Vox amps, either. I believe I remember someone having similar problems with a Carvin, maybe a Framus, or maybe a Randall, or maybe I'm just remembering something else.

Anyway, I hope this helps somewhat. Just keep trying different combinations until something reduces the hiss to a level that you can live with, if it doesn't completely go away. Oh, FWIW, my Orange Rocker 30 has always been much quieter than my Vox AC30 Reissue, no matter what I've got plugged into either of them.

Oh, and I agree with you that, in your rig, using GTR/AMP levels is the way to go. Line-Levels might cause more problems than they'd solve, in your setup at least.

Hope you figure something out that works better for you. Definitely keep us posted of your progress! If there's anything more I can do to help you figure this out, just let me know, ok? Good Luck!!

[mavrick12x]

i've gone thru about every cable i have and they all lead to the same hiss. wall wart configuration was no change. i've tried keeping the two apart from each other on different outlets as well.

bypass settings were on DSY… i tried all three. the only noticable difference was on relay setting. when my effects were off. the hiss almost went away.  but as soon as I engaged the pedal it was back. this is probably going to be the bypass setting i use from now on. when im using high gain I usually dont have the delay on anyway. but with the relay settings I wont hear the hiss when its off. this is a plus but it doesnt solve the issue for me. kinda more like a bandaid…

[timothyhill]

Have you tried using a different tube in the V1 position in the amp? Wouldn't be my first guess, but I've seen tubes that have caused this kind of thing before. Maybe a little rare, but nowhere near unheard of. V1 is the most likely culprit, but I've seen power tubes do weird things like that, too, by throwing off the voltage to the other tubes just enough. But, as before, I don't have a schematic for your amp, so I can't be any more specific.

Other than that, the iso box would be my last suggestion before I'd recommend taking it to a qualified tech. It seems to me that a lot of the similar problems mentioned on this forum recently were related to something other than the pedal, but that's not to say that it's not the pedal, either. It could be, but without seeing it personally, I can't say for sure, and it could be a problem with the pickups or potentiometers, maybe even the jack in the guitar itself, or the settings on your amp, or more likely a combination of issues. It could be a bad solder joint on one of the jacks in the pedal, too.

I think the best that anyone can do, without having the gear on a test-bench, is to just suggest and try alternatives until, hopefully, something starts sounding better. I really do wish you luck with this… the TF is truly an amazing piece of kit.

[racetra]

Its the Pedal.

 I just hooked mine up today brand new out of the box and it also does this. I hooked up a Boss NS-2 Noise suppressor and it got rid of the hiss. This really sucks for a $400 pedal. I will be ordering an ISP Decimator. It is a great delay and I really like the banks and the way you can setup presets. I haven't run it through my rig yet since I am still puttin it together. I should be done with it in a couple of days so we will see.

[mavrick12x]

let us know what you find that works. thanks

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