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April 8, 2011 at 4:27 pm #107783Davide SchachterMember
I hope this is the right place to ask about the Space…
I have the TF and the MF when I set their bypass type to relay there is an audible click but if I do the same to my new Space there is no click of any kind, e.g switching from dsp to relay or vice versa. Is it supposed to be like that or something is wrong with my unit?
April 8, 2011 at 4:53 pm #121893nickroseModeratorEventide Staff
This is the Place for the Space. Poetry ..
You only get the relay click if BYPASS TYPE is set to RELAY. On Space, the default setting is DSP. Feel free to change it if you want the reassuring click.. (UM p.36)
April 10, 2011 at 12:26 am #121904Davide SchachterMember
I went to the NYC store where I bought it and I showed them your reply to my post: we were both SHOCKED by the lack of professionalism and how disrespectful this reply is. I do have sense of humor but I believe this is totally out of place here. I just said that I already own 2 of your stompboxes plus Space which make a total of $1100 of my hardly earned money spent for Eventide effects and the reply that I get is " Feel free to change it if you want the reassuring click"?!. I do not need to be reassured by a click, what does this mean? That some units work silently and some do the click but both work perfectly fine? BTW I already exchanged my unit and it does the click so why just not admitting that the unit I had was not working properly? I don't understand that but what I do understand is why you guys have to approve our posts before publishing them, you know? Just give us some professional support and take the humor away. Thanks
April 10, 2011 at 7:27 pm #133103AAgnelloModeratorEventide Staff
We apologize and certainly meant no disrespect.
As to whether there should or shouldn't be a click I can only say that the bypass circuitry for the Factors and for Space is identical. When any of these units are set for Relay bypass, upon bypass, the input jacks are directly connected to the output jacks through the relay. It becomes a hardwired connection. The relays themselves make a clicking sound as the contacts engage. Of course, the footswitch also makes a click. So if you are using the footswitch to bypass, and you listen closely, you will hear the relay's click in addition to the footswitch. Of course, I'm describing the sound coming from the box as opposed to the audio signal.
As to the audio signal, the switching of the relay contacts will introduce a click on the audio signal. This can be very faint or not depending on how things are connected. What I mean is that, the Factors and Space are biased at zero volts DC. So, when they are Active and with no signal at the input, the output sits at zero volts DC. If the input of the pedal comes from a source that has a DC component when the relay bypasses that non-zero DC component will instantly 'click' in and, depending on the amount of DC and the gain of the amp following the pedal, the resulting audio click could be quite pronounced.
I'd be curious to learn whether your original Space had a problem. Every pedal that we ship is individually tested for audio performance. We do toggle the relay as part of final test. Hopefully the NY store will return the pedal to us with a trouble report.
Finally, I must stand in defense of Nick Rose. Eventide support is, by and large, handled by our developers not by sales or marketing types. I admit that over the years, from time to time, this tradition has gotten us into trouble but I wouldn't have it any other way.
April 10, 2011 at 9:18 pm #133104Davide SchachterMember
I am sure that your Staff Member didn't mean to be disrespectful, but that wasn't the kind of answer I was looking for. Believe me you get a little anxious when you spend $500 and it turns out that the unit is not totally ok If the relay mechanism is a mechanical hardwiring it should click, and that one wasn't. That's why my question was whether or not the relay should do that click as my two other boxes would do that too. As I said i already traded mine with another one which has a smaller serial # by one number, I prefer not to mention the name of the NYC store where I bought it, and don't know what they will do with that unit. All my boxes are registered with the Eventide website so you can see where I bought them and serial #s. Anyway I am in love with these boxes, I wish you guys would find a definitive solutions for the power supply, I am not going to buy a CIOK dc and spending $200, why don't you guys come out with something? I am carrying around a multiple strip and 3 of your wall adaptors for the total weight of 1.65 kilos (3.3lbs). Thanks for your detailed reply.
April 10, 2011 at 9:35 pm #133105AAgnelloModeratorEventide Staff
Thanks. I'll follow-up on the click-less Space. wrt, power supplies its simply not our area of expertise. For a small company its always a struggle to stay focused but we think it best for us, and for our users, to stick to our knitting. CIOKS makes a solid product and they offered to work with us. We've tested their supplies and made a few suggestions that they've incorporated.
April 11, 2011 at 11:18 pm #133108guitarlessonMember
we were both SHOCKED by the lack of professionalism and how disrespectful this reply is.
I am SHOCKED by the complete lack of chill-the-frick-out-dude.
First of all, the guys at Eventide are WAY awesome for taking the time to chat with their customers on a REGULAR basis. I for one am glad for and prefer the laid back nature of the Eventide Staffers, and I'd bet money on the fact that most people here agree with me.
I have two Factor pedals as well, and they both click slightly when the relays activate. So do my true-bypass analog stompboxes, and so does my pickup selector in my guitar. I even work for a guy who manufactures effects pedals, and they click a little too. Why? Because all of these devices are physical, mechanical switches that break or connect an analog audio signal. Some relays click more than others, but they all click. This is not a flaw, but a matter of preference. If you don't like the click, go to DSP mode.
To Eventide, keep up the good work, guys. Thanks for all your help.
April 12, 2011 at 7:13 pm #133110timothyhillMember
Speaking as a "free range human" (Eclipse UM p7), absolutely! I'm hard pressed to think of many companies in the MI industry that provide as friendly, prompt, and helpful advice as Eventide does. Very few even come close. I absolutely appreciate and respect the time and attention that Eventide gives to all of its customers. I agree with guitarlesson… I seriously doubt that we're the only ones who feel that way.
April 12, 2011 at 8:36 pm #133111davidkaeserParticipant
April 12, 2011 at 9:06 pm #133112badmelonfarmerParticipant
April 12, 2011 at 10:35 pm #133114usehernameMember
Manufacturers barely allow forums at all on their sites today let alone actually participate. Many times written text gets interpreted wrongly. Anyone who has ever communicated via chat or Email has encountered this. I would have thought twice before criticizing Nick for that reply. I found nothing offensive or "shocking" in his timely response. I would like to know the NYC store that was shocked at that post…
April 13, 2011 at 12:36 am #133115quintessenceMember
I just wanted to +1 the comments left by guitarlesson and timothyhill. Eventide is indeed a rare breed of company to have this much direct contact with its product users. This site is *REPLETE* with examples of Eventide staff members going that extra mile to address the problems, concerns and ideas of it's customers. The fact that they are open enough to show humor and personality, to me, just makes them that much more approachable and sincere.
April 13, 2011 at 6:20 pm #133119rabiddiabetic13Member
I can see both sides of this. Yes Eventide is unprecedented in having access to employees in the forum and the fact they listen to customer’s opinions and request is great.
On the other hand did Nick really answer his question? I read Davide’s question to be “hey my other factor pedals click when set to true bypass my Space does not, do I have a problem. It can be nerve wrenching when you dole out a good amount of your hardly earned money (I like that by the way) and you just want to make sure all is good with the gear.
Did he overact a little, maybe but what if the shoe was on the other foot. We know Nick is a good guy and did not mean any harm but let’s cut Davide some slack too.
April 13, 2011 at 6:51 pm #133120thomMember
The guy was not complaining because of the click, he was saying the unit didn't make a click in relay bypass mode. He expected it to do so and was asking why there was no audible click when using the relays.
I too appreciate Eventide having this forum and the fact that they have helped me out. I like their approach and I like their products, but in this case the original poster had a valid question and I too thought the initial response a bit poor, just saying. The delay in posting is also annoying. I t kills discussion in my opinion.
April 14, 2011 at 5:39 pm #133131timothyhillMember
I agree with rabiddiabetic13, too. Although I've thought a lot about this thread since it first appeared, I'm really just at a loss for words. This whole thing has just been atypical (thankfully) and not really one of our most shining moments.
Did Davide over-react? Probably a little, but as rabid said, it's understandable. These pedals are not inexpensive. Was Nick's answer meant to dismiss or offend? Seriously doubt it… I'm sure he's got a lot more important things to do than think of ways to insult customers. The dialog between AAgnello and Davide seems to have resolved the original issue. Did we as forum members over-react, too? Probably.
So what have we really learned here? We're all guilty of over-reacting sometimes, it's just human nature. I think we're missing the most obvious thing, though… instead of trying to figure out who to blame, we should all be writing poetry about Space. Think about how many painful poems we could come up with… Space Ace gracefully replaced his Versace bass case… I could go on, but really… I'd rather be spending my time making music and putting the new V3b16 release through its paces, or tracing a vase with lace on my face, or having a race with mace… (oh, NO, I can't STOP!!!)
I really need to get a life…
April 16, 2011 at 1:51 am #133180Davide SchachterMember
Thanks for spending your time on this topic, thanks THOM and TIMOTHYHILL for actually reading my posts, you guys totally got my point. I need to make this clear for other folks here: when I opened this topic I was looking for some help from Eventide, help that eventually came and I am totally satisfied with both product and support. I am not aware of any any other way to get support other than the forum itself otherwise I wouldn't have posted my discontent here. I didn't mean to be disrespectful and I am sorry if criticizing NickRose hurt someone's feelings, but I didn't feel really helped out by his reply as I am sure he has been very helpful a million other times, anyway I extend my apologizes to Nick Rose himself.
April 18, 2011 at 4:45 pm #133193timothyhillMember
Thanks, Davide! I'm glad to know that this hasn't soured your experience with Eventide's products or this forum. Hope to hear more from you in the future!
FYI, you can always reach Eventide Support by email firstname.lastname@example.org or by phone (201) 641-1200 from 9:00am to 5:00pm, Monday through Friday.
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