TF looper

[pauliusmm]

Hello,

i managed to get a good midi sync for delay effects on TF, but the looper does not stay with a midi

clock, is there a way to improve it?

also it would be great to have UNDO function for looper, for example holding stop switch could UNDO last overdub.

thanks

[nickrose]

You really can't use MIDIclock for long term sync of a delay based process – there is bound to be some drift, which means it will lose sync over time. As it does.

Undo for looper is tough, cos it would double the storage requirements (have to save both old and new at the same time), meaning that the playback length would be cut in half. Probably not many people would want this.

[pauliusmm]

With all due respect i don't agree about using midi clock. I use
midi clock to sync my other looper and it stays right with the source
.I think it depends on clock source mostly: some devices send midi clock
constantly and some sends it only once- when start is pressed. It should stay solidly if the source is sending midi clock constantly.

I don't know what you mean by saying "long terms", but i hope it could stay at least for one song (3-4 minutes) otherwise if you can't use sync for a song , why use it?

i'm just saying that i think its possible to sync things solidly with midi clock, correct me if i am wrong.

[nickrose]

What is your "other looper" and what is your MIDIclock source ?

I'd like to have a look at them and see how they compare.

[pauliusmm]

I use Roger Linn Adrenalinn III as midi clock source which sends midi clock to all my midi devices. I use Electro Harmonix 2880 Super Multi Track Looper which can sync to external clock source.

[nickrose]

I'm still a little uncertain. Are you recording into the looper at one tempo and playing back at another ?

If so, why ? Also, does this give you a pitch change ?

[pauliusmm]

NO, i am syncing looper to Adrenalinn's drum beats,

Adrenalinn can output drum beat loops on external output so i want to route audio click to my drummers headphones and midi clock to my looper. So now drummer can play in sync with looper.

that works fine, it would be nice if i could do it with TF also

If i would change the trempo it would change the pitch but thats not important for me since i will not change tempo during the song

I don't know if i explained it clear, if not- let me know, i will try to explain it again.

[nickrose]

I may be being dim here, so please be patient…

If you are not changing the tempo, why sync the looper to the MIDIclock at all ? It's crystal controlled (as they say), so should play back accurately at the same speed of the recording.

I'll look into the EHX, but we consider a totally accurate MIDIclock synched playback to be rather difficult. But, we would be including pitch change into this, so maybe we are making it more difficult than it needs to be.

[pauliusmm]

reason for sync is because 2880 looper can quantize loop lenght in bars. if there is drum beat synced to a looper, i can record anything lets say a syncopated riff and i know it will stay with a beat exactly as i recorded it, it will not drift ahead or beyond from the beat.

As an example you can try record a riff with a looper while listening to any drum beat. You will not record it to match the drum beat timing perfectly as this is almost impossible. But if you sync and quantize the loop to a drumbeat your recorded riff will play along with a drumbeat tight..

Now 2880 looper has an audible click (which volume you can turn down), and you can sync that click to midi clock. You can also quantize the loop in bars (bar = 4 clicks), so for example you can record a loop that is exactly 4 bars long ( or as many bars as you want).

the problem with TF is when the Adrenalinn beat starts -TF loop starts also but when the loop cycle repeats – its ahead of the beat, and when it cycles again its even more ahead  and so on.Its like playing with a deaf drummer – your loop plays its time and drumbeats plays its time independently.

there is no such problem with 2880 looper, when i start the beat -the loop cycles but it stays right in the same place with the beat.

[nickrose]

Beginning to understand – there may be multiple issues. The TF may be playing back too fast, and/or the loop length may be inaccurate. When you say it is ahead of the beat after the restart, can you give a number for how much ?

Presumably if it was playing too fast you would notice, so the error may be mainly in the loop length or the turnaround time. For example, does it stay on the beat during the first playback, and then lose it after the restart ?

If this is the problem, I can look into it.

[pauliusmm]

yes i think it might be loop lenght or something

its like in a few cycles it is approximately  1/16 ahead (or beyond -i don't remember) and further it drifts in similar way away .

try syncing it to drum machine and record a riff, and you will see.

but i think something like a loop quantize would solve the problem.

[labalou]

ah finally Eventide is listening!!! htis is actually one of the reasons i bought the TF to be able to sync its looper to my adrenalinn as well but was really dissapointed when i found out it didnt.I posted this very problem a couple of years back but didnt see any reactions from eventide.

Yo cannot imagine how many people are looking for a compact looper that will do this,most stomp loopers dont have midi sync which is ashame.The only one is indeed the EH, the boss RC-50 does it but is big, Echoplex does this at best but is rack mount and it requires a midi foot controller.

It would be awesome if the TF also sent a start stop comand to a drum machine,i mean this is expected of a midi device with a looper,if not whats the point really!

Ill be jumping of joy fi this every becomes reality! just imagine having in a pedalboard the TF with the adrenalinn all compact!

[yakekain]

any news about this ?

any plan to put this in a future V3 update ?

make some 4/4 loop in total midi sync 

TF receives midi clock and starts,

records 1 or 2 measures then loop exactly. 

This is possible with the EH 16second Digital Delay, you can choose a length (1, 2, 4, 8 measures)

before looping.

[Imerkat]

+1 on a midi quantize loops

+1,000 on finding a drummer that is willing to play to an audio click

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