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November 18, 2008 at 4:02 pm #105930benjiskanMember
I play the guitar, and after using many multi-effects for 16 years, I decided to buy an Eventide (Elipse v3.5), thinking I would do whatever I want, at last (my main effect was an old Digitech GSP 2101, and it works fine, just no tap tempo, so many copy/past sounds with different programmed tempos…+ Gforce etc….)
I was a bit surprised at first by the way it works (choosing algorythms, not creating some…), but it was ok, because it is easy to use, and because it sounds SO GOOD .
BUT, after few days of use, I'm facing a problem. I WANT TO USE IT LIVE, and I feel like programming sounds in the Eclipse will be a pain, such a pain indeed. And I'm a bit disapointed.
As programs need loading time ( very bad surprise when I though there was not, and thinking I was having the most powerfull guitar effect on earth …), if I'm right, I can only use single block "Xfade" algorythm so that there is no cut between my differents sounds ( I use around 6 different sounds per song….). Otherwise, it's just IMPOSSIBLE TO PLAY!! [:'(]
There are many incredible sounds in the Eclipse, I was enjoying it so much, but when you're limitated to 1block, it's not the same deal, and you'd better find an algorythm to work on to find what you want.
After many attemps to have some decent basic sounds with a reverb in one block, I'm facing a problem guys, because I want a cool flanger with a reverb which supports Xfade…. and there is nothing. My bro told me to use a short delay with huge feedback….. same problem with my "+7th +12th harmo" sound which is not good …it's saturating when pitches are played at the same time (or I must cut feedback, but it's less rich… keep working on it)
What do you recommend to have a flanger+reverb in 1 block so I can have xfade?
Will there be some upgrades so that loading times disapear?
Will there be some improves so that we can use the 2 blocks, have rich sounds, and have xfade when changing them? Or will there never be a real "guitar dedicated" Eventide product? (Because it's a pitty to have such beautifull sounds but never use them live….except having a 10.000 USD rack)
PS: I have my Eclipse for less than 1 week, just have time after work to work on it, so maybe I'm wrong at some points. But my GSP 2101, more than 10 years old, is much more flexible and offers better possibilities at this point (but doesn't sound as good, ok)
November 18, 2008 at 4:13 pm #118037nickroseModeratorEventide Staff
We continue to do a lot of work to improve loading time, which is now several times faster than when the Eclipse was first introduced.
But, the simple fact is that the reason Eclipse sounds so good is that it has large and complex algorithms that inevitably take time to load. You do have the choice between the smaller xfadeable algorithms versus the larger ones, but as always in life, there is a cost for the better things.
For a "guitar-dedicated" product, look at the Factor stomp box series, which have simpler algorithms that load faster.
November 18, 2008 at 4:23 pm #118038IDeangelisMember
there are different architectures when it comes to FX processors. Some are closed, you choose the factory algorithms and create your tweaks (Eclipse), others are semi_open, you have a choice of different pre_made algorithms that can be freely connected in an audio chain (your Digitech/GForce), finally are the true open ones which offer pre_made algorithms and offer the user the possibility to create his/her own and do anything (Eventide H-series).
The reason why Eclipse is not instnt at changes is that algorithms need to be decompiled and re_compiled at loading time. This is also the reason why it sounds so good, as the full power of the dsp is used to provide the best possible fx in that context.
There are smart ways around! Instead of actually changing algorithms, one could use (and should!) MIDI CC messges to turn fx on/off and to change aspects of an effect to get a different one. A chors can be easily turned into a flanger by reducing delay time and raising feedback. This is possible in Eclipse.
As an example you could have a preset made of ChorusDelays (#106) in block A followed by Mshift+Reverb (#184) in block B. The first would easily provide stereo TapTempo modulated delays + chorus/flange (using the trick I mentioned above), while the second provides pitch shifting and reverb. That's already a lot of effects at *high* audio quality.
flanger+reverb in a block for crossfades > load #183 Chordlys+Verb8.
This will give you 4 delay lines you can use in pairs to create stereo taptempo Delay + Flanger/Chorus AND Reverb…and it's just one block!
Or…you could consider our H_series Ultra Harminizers with their monster MIDI Virtual Rack presets library, where you have 5 full blown fx processors in a preset in which you can program 10 different tweaks, including fx on/off + parameters settings. When you recall the preset a simple MIDI CC message with 10 different values can recall any of the 10 tweaks. It's like having ten presets i one!…There are many variations on this theme in the H-Series, plus the building blocks for those willing to assemble their racks with Vsigfile PC Algorithm Editor. You can check the very last pages of the Presets Manual for more info on these monsters!
all the best
November 18, 2008 at 4:28 pm #118039benjiskanMember
Well, thanks for your fast replies. I'll check all this out tonight
November 20, 2008 at 2:54 pm #118041petrucci69Member
HI IDeangelis ,
first sorry for my english,i'm french.I have an eclipse, i've got the same problems, the loading time between my presets is very long,so with a band it's very hard to play songs with presets changes.How can i do? maybe an update with fast loading? please give me answer,
Thanks a lot!
November 20, 2008 at 3:13 pm #129162IDeangelisMember
we have released a number of OS updates that make presets loading much faster than it was before. The change will never be instant, no matter how much we can improve this area. It's a structural aspect that can't be changed. As with most professional devices one will have to learn how to live with this. As I have explained, most of the times people reload presets that have the same effects with different settings; instead of doing so, the use of MIDI CC messages can help changing FX aspects instead of reloading another preset. This is what people have being doing for many years now, with all the classic studio quality FX processors. Most of them have always been slow… something that provides the best audio quality in your fx, though.
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